On last night's ABC Prime Time in the US, a defector from the bin Laden cult was interviewed. For his own safety, his identity was protected. He stated that there are a thousand people willing to sacrifice themselves for bin Laden.

For excerpts, see:

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/primetime/2020/primetime010926_mr_x_excerpts. html

Sept. 27, 2001 - A defector from Osama bin Laden's terrorist organization, al Qaeda, has told ABCNEWS that one of the men accused of hijacking the planes used in the Sept. 11 attacks trained with him at one of the terrorist mastermind's camps in Afghanistan.

The defector said he trained for six months at a camp in Afghanistan to become an intelligence agent for bin Laden. When shown photographs of the 19 hijackers, the defector said he recognized one of them, a man federal investigators have identified as Majed Moqed, a possible Saudi national.

"Yeah . He was with my class ... I could recognize him from his face," the defector said. "he is from Saudi Arabia, and he's about 20, 25 to 30 years old"

The Department of Justice has identified Moqed as one of five men suspected of taking control of American Airlines Flight 77 and crashing the plane into the Pentagon.

If the defector is right, he may have provided an important link between bin Laden and the hijackers. Federal investigators have said they have concrete information linking one or more of the hijackers to al Qaeda but they have not publicly linked any of the suspects directly to bin Laden or his camps.

The defector, who is now living outside Afghanistan, said he was shocked by the attacks, but not surprised that the attackers were willing to give their lives for bin Laden and his cause.

"Yeah, I was shocked, but I know them better, that they are not only 19 people. There are a thousand people who want to sacrifice themselves for bin Laden, not only 19. There are more than a thousand. All of them - in Europe, in Canada or in Saudi Arabia - all of them want to do this kind of actions. Terrorist actions."

He said there were 18 other students in his class at the training camp. He said he received training in how to conduct surveillance and how to gather detailed information on potential targets. He said he heard people talk of hijacking airliners, but that he never heard anything about a plot to crash jets into buildings in New York and Washington.

He said bin Laden spoke to his class several times, warning that the United States and Israel wanted to destroy Islam, and that they must be destroyed first. He said his 18 fellow students were sent home to cities in Europe, the Middle East and Canada where they were to wait - as sleeper agents - for instructions.

He said he had no doubt his fellow students would obey any instructions that came from bin Laden. "If bin Laden asked [you] to put a bomb on your body and explode it. they won't say no. They will do that," he said.

After two years in bin Laden's organization, the defector said he became disillusioned with so many plots that targeted innocent civilians. He has defected from al Qaeda and is now cooperating with the U.S. government.

He doubted that the U.S. military, or even special forces, would be able to capture bin Laden in Afghanistan.

"It is impossible to find bin Laden. Bin Laden has many, many places in Afghanistan. You cannot find him," he said, adding that bin Laden is still guarded by a cadre of heavily armed bodyguards, including three of his sons.

Plot to Free Jailed Cleric Described

In an earlier interview with ABCNEWS, before the Sept. 11 attacks, the same defector said that bin Laden had plans to free Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman - jailed in connection with the 1993 World Trade Center bombing - from his maximum-security prison, possibly by kidnapping Americans.

"The next plan is to release Omar Abdel Rahman from jail," said the man - identified only as "Max" - during an interview conducted earlier this year in a secret location by ABCNEWS' John Miller.

The former bin Laden associate provided a unique look inside the al Qaeda terrorist network in the two exclusive interviews, which aired on PrimeTime Thursday.

Asked by Miller how al Qaeda might hope to free Rahman, "Max" said, "Maybe they kidnap [an] ambassador there . and bring him to Afghanistan and ask for release."

He said he believes bin Laden would be willing to conduct an armed operation to obtain his goal, noting that while "it would be very difficult for them to do this release . they are trying, even now, just looking for a chance."

The following are some excerpts from the interviews:

On Moqed's Connection with Osama Bin Laden

JOHN MILLER, ABCNEWS Max, I'm going to ask them to hand you the pictures of the hijackers and I'd like you to look at them for a minute and tell me when you've had a chance to study them.. Do you see anybody on there that you know?

"MAX" Yeah. I just know one of them. he was in Afghanistan, in training camp. Yeah, I'm sure.

MILLER And he was in the camp - training at the same time you were?

"MAX" Yeah. Yeah, he was at the same time. He was with my class.

MILLER And the name that you see there - is that a different name from the one he used?

"MAX" Name, yeah. I just, I could, recognize from his face. he is from Saudi Arabia, and he's about 20, 25 to 30 years old?.

MILLER Are you surprised to learn that he's one of the hijackers?

"MAX" Yeah, you know, each of them wanted to sacrifice on Osama bin Laden. They want to spend their money and their - everything, to sacrifice themselves on bin Laden. There was, you know, anyone that bin Laden asked them to do - to kill themselves, to sacrifice themselves on bin Laden. he won't say no. There are a thousand people; they want to sacrifice themselves on bin Laden.

MILLER You know Americans were shocked that 19 men would commit suicide - even in a plot like this. Were you shocked?

"MAX" Yeah, I was shocked, but I know them better, that they are not only 19 people. There are a thousand people, they want to sacrifice themselves for bin Laden; they are not only 19. There are more than a thousand. All of them ? in Europe, in Canada or in Saudi Arabia - all of them want to do this kind of terrorism action.

MILLER And the men you trained with? The men who went home to their countries like Canada and Saudi Arabia and the United Kingdom and France - all of them you feel were also prepared to die if called on?

"MAX" Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because they want to be on the front line of fighting in Afghanistan and was too dangerous. many people killed in frontline fighting. So they want to sacrifice themselves on bin Laden, each of them..

If bin Laden asked [you] to put a bomb on your body and explode it with yourself, they won't say no. They will do that..

On Bin Laden's Fear of Being Killed by the U.S.:

MILLER Does [Osama bin Laden] believe that he is going to be killed?

"MAX" Yeah, he believes that. sure. That he will be killed by the United States.

MILLER And is he afraid of that?

"MAX" Yeah, because he doesn't stay more than 48 hours in one location. And he changes cars, and buses, and so, it means that he's scared [of the]

United States.

MILLER If he was killed by the United States, well do you think he's prepared for that? Do you think it would make him a martyr?

"MAX" Yeah, but there are other people: his assistant, and his other people, his sons. They will all work for the state of bin Laden. Yeah.

MILLER So even if bin Laden were killed, the organization will go on?

"MAX" Yeah, because there's many other people.they're working for bin Laden. It's not that small organization.

On How Many People are Working for Bin Laden:

MILLER How many people are there, working for him - right now?

"MAX" It's more than 3,000. Different nationalities.

MILLER All armed - all in the camps?

"MAX" Yeah. Armed. Yeah. And in Afghanistan. But also outside Afghanistan, there is many, many people, trained, in that camp. And they are working outside the country.

MILLER In Afghanistan, Pakistan. ?

"MAX" Saudi Arabia, Canada. Europe.

On 'Brainwashing' in the Camps:

MILLER In the training camps there were people who were willing to sacrifice their lives. How did they get people to that point? Was there a process of indoctrination or brainwashing? How did they convince them?

"MAX" Yeah, there was brainwashing. Even when I was there, I wanted to sacrifice myself for bin Laden. But when I got to Pakistan and I met some of the people from my family, my relatives who were in the United States and they seemed like us.. There's no difference between us and them. So I understood that we were doing wrong..

MILLER How did the brainwashing work?

"MAX" He told us that the United States wants to destroy Islam and kill all Muslims, and you want to capture all countries, the Arab countries, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates.. They were saying these things everyday. They wanted to change our ideas and they could change our ideas.

On How Bin Laden Travels:

"MAX" He has an old bus - Mercedes. It's very old. So, when he traveling somewhere, nobody know that he. nobody knows that he is in this bus.

On the Meal He Served Bin Laden:

MILLER What did he have?

"MAX" Uh, macaroni? Cheese.

MILLER Osama bin Laden eats macaroni and cheese?

"MAX" Cheese, [laughs]. yeah. Yeah. He like that.