From: "Chris Ho-Stuart" Newsgroups: aus.religion.christian Chris: Before I say anything else on the topic at hand... Gladys; > thanks very much for giving some references. This really > helps discussion. > Gladys wrote: > [snip] > > 1. From my readings about evolution the implication is that > > as humans developed from a common ancestor - an ape-like > > being - that they had to acquire human attributes which took > > many years. > C: Yes. > G: When the English settlement was started in 1788 fully clothed > > people found a group of near-nigh naked, dark-skinned people > > with whom they could not converse because they did not know > > the language and assumptions were made about their culture > > based on ignorance. It was obvious their shelters were > > rudimentary, their living was nomadic. As the uni-cellular > > to multicelluar plants and animals came to be accepted by > > some there was a slotting of all forms of life into that > > 'ladder'. Many would have seen the Aborigine as a sub-human > > or early stage of human development. > C: The "Scala Naturae", or ladder of nature, is straight out > of Aristotle; about 2300 years ago. > > Evolution, and Darwinism, marks the REFUTATION of the > ladder of existence. > > You have this 100% wrong again. Darwin's work refuted the old > notion of allocating life to a ladder, or a great chain of > being. The evolutionary model is of a tree, or bush. ALL human > races are equally descended from a common ancestor. Darwin knew > this; and he was well ahead of his time in calling for human > rights for all humans. He was bitterly opposed to slavery and > to imposed ranking on the races, or regarded different races as > being "inferior". > > Think for a minute... 1788 is about seventy years before > Darwin published the Origin. Did the problems of Aborigines > date from 1788, or from 1859? > > It is fascinating to read about how Darwin clashed with Fitzroy > on this. Fitzroy was the captin of the Beagle, on which Darwin > sailed around the world in the 1830s. Fitzroy was a very strict > Christian; one might even say fundamentalist. Most certainly he > was a creationist. And it was Fitzroy who argued for blacks as > having a rightful places as slaves and subservients to superior > races, and it was Darwin who regarded this is degrading and > immoral and unjustifiable. They had serious clashes on this > subject. > > It is also revealing to read "The Descent of Man", which Darwin > published in 1871. > > Darwin speaks of the "so-called races of man"; the qualifier > "so-called" is his own. Darwin argues at some length that > all humans are one species. He points out that the greatest > difference between the so-called races is simply skin > colour. His examples of intelligence and moral sense and so > on are taken from all races; and he does not elevate his own > "race" to any higher biological status. > > The great chain of being, which was the basic model BEFORE > Darwin, was something like this. > Rocks... plants... animals.... apes.... negros... greeks > > Darwin replaced this with a tree, something like this: > > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > X X > X ___/ } modern X > X / \ } apes X > X / X > X /--+ X > X / \ X > X / \ greeks X > X + \____/ (and all humans) X > X \ \negros X > X \ X > X \ ___ X > X \ / X > X \---+ (etc. Other animals) X > X \ ____ X > X \/ X > X \--- X > X X > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > G: 2. from Creation Ex Nihilo Vol 14 2 titled 'Darwin's > > Bodysnatchers' information is given that in the late > > 1800's there was deliberate slaughter of some Aborigines > > for scientific research in Europe and England - some by > > phrenologists who worked on the brain size to determine > > degree of humanness. Quote - "A gruesome trade in 'missing > > link' specimens began with early evolutionary/racist > > ideas. But this trade really 'took off' with the advent of > > Darwinism..... perhaps 10 000 dead bodies of Australia's > > Aboriginal people were shipped to British museums in a > > frenzied attempt to prove the widespread belief that they > > were the 'missing link'." > C: This abysmal and offensive idiocy fails to note that the > the collection of human remains dates from BEFORE Darwinism. > It may have begun with early evolutionary ideas, if by early > you mean pre-Darwinian ideas based on a ladder of being. > Darwin refutes this idea, and the notion of Aborigines as a > missing link is a direct contradiction with evolutionary > theory and Darwin's ideas in particular. > > I am angry almost past description that Creation Ex Nihilo > sinks to such depths. The problems of racism are serious, > and for Answers in Genesis to lie and distort the facts in > order to smear evolution is utterly contemptible. > > Evolution is one of the strongest arguments AGAINST racism > imaginable. Evolution is the OPPOSITE of the ladder of > existence. By evolutionary theory the many so-called > races are all equally descended from missing links in the > PAST. The evolutionary model of a tree has the so-called > races as being like sisters of the same parents. > G: I have read in part, scanned other parts, the book 'One > > Blood' by John Harris (title from Paul's words in Bible - > > New Testament - Acts 17 : 26 " God has made of one blood all > > nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth.) > > It is an honest appraisal of the relations of Christians > > and Aborigines from 1788. They had to work from ignorance > > through to understanding. Some were not suited for their > > work with Aborigines - others were highly valued by both the > > Aborigines and local white populations for their selfless > > dedication. Aboriginal languages were being written down by > > the mid 1800's. With that contact attitudes were changing > > and understandings of Aboriginal life made for better > > communication. > > > > Christians did not deserve the unblanced media reports > > - evidently by secularist-evolutionists from the late > > 1960's. Yes, there were failures, but there were also > > successes. Many Aboriginges, livng in modern conditions are > > glad the English came here - despite the early difficulties. > > Must away - will post further when the computer problems > > are rectified. Gladys > C: I mostly agree with you here, with some reservations. The story > of Christians and Aborigines is a very mixed one, but many > Christians certainly contibuted to improvement of the situation. > > Cheers -- Chris