From: “Ken Smith”
Newsgroups: aus.religion.christian
Subject: Re: The questions of existence
Ken: I’ve stayed out of this interesting thread because I’m a bit
> overloaded at the moment, but one comment by Rowland made me
> reconsider my isolation.
Contributor: Some have an experience which they attribute directly to God,
and
> >> a personal interaction with God.
>
Rowland: Others have similar experiences which they attribute to other
> >causes/entities…
>
C: Some believe in God because they trust the witness of others (or
> >> of the bible) to God’s existence.
>
R: Ditto of anything/anyone beyond our immediate senses…
>
> >(The Bible BTW doesn’t set out to prove God’s existence; simply assumes
it -
> >see Genesis 1:1)
> >>
C: Some believe in God because they infer the existence of a creator
> >> from a universe, or other phenomena.
>
R: Includes the notion of a ‘first cause’. (Why can’t there be an infinite
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >regression of causes?). Nature? Wot about ‘red in tooth and claw’ – can’t
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >see God there…
>
Ken (a university mathematician): Why not, indeed?
> This is the major problem with the traditional “Five Ways” of Aquinas.
> For those unacquainted with them, these were attempts to prove the
> existence of God by appealing to reason.
> Most of them, in effect, ruled out an infinite regression of causes,
> but provided no reason for this.
>
> The same thing occurs in mathematics, and one of the basic axioms of
> set theory is the axiom of foundation which, essentially, rules out
> any such infinite regression.
> If you don’t explicitly include such an axiom then you can have
> infinite regressions.
>
> And in this case you work back through a sequence of causes without
> ever coming to a “first cause”.
> Salaam
> Ken Smith
>
> –
> Dr Ken Smith – Christian, husband, unpaid mathematician, skeptic, …
> `The current controversy is the result of addressing improper questions
> to the biblical material. Science asks how and when; religion asks
why
> and what does it mean.’ Brent Philip Waters