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Garry and Jill Allen wrote:
>
> The following quote is courtesy of "Today", a magazine published by the
> Hunter Revival fellowship Inc, picked up by a friend of mine at their
> annual conference
> "What we believe...
> We believe in the infallibility of the Bible.
> We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
> We believe the gospel of His death, resurrection and the directive to
> repent, be baptised and receive the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2:38)
> We believe in the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit in the Church.
> We believe in prayer for the sick and that god heals people.
> We believe that the Bible identifies the Anglo-Saxon people with the Old
> Testament nation of Israel, and gives signs of the imminent return of
> Christ."
>
> Garry Allen

I'd like to comment on this, but first:

Would someone from the RF's like to challenge this statement as
authentic for the whole movement in Australia?

Graeme wrote:
>
> (Nigel B. Mitchell) wrote:
>
> > We believe in the infallibility of the Bible.
> > We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
> > We believe the gospel of His death, resurrection and the directive to
> > repent, be baptised and receive the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2:38)
> > We believe in the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit in the Church.
> > We believe in prayer for the sick and that god heals people.
> > We believe that the Bible identifies the Anglo-Saxon people with the
> >Old Testament nation of Israel, and gives signs of the imminent return
> >of Christ."
>
> >This is an interesting statement of faith.
> >I suspect that just about all Christians would agree with all of the
> >statements above, except for the first and the last.
>
> >Personally, I reject the first because it is a form of idolatry;
> >giving an attribute which proerly can only be ascribed to God
> >(infallibility) to a book produced by fallible (albeit divinely
> >inspired) human beings.
>
> The first statement is absolutely correct and there is nothing
> idolatrous about it. Psalm 138:2 indicates the value that God puts on
> His Word -- "thou hast magnified thy word above they name [person]."
> The Word of God is the mind of Christ -- 1 Cor. 2:16. We are to feed
> on it, make it the priority of our life. Only by that means can we
> grow to spiritual maturity. The Word of God IS infallible. To say that
> calling it thus is giving is giving it an attribute that can only be
> ascribed to God is a contradiction -- absurd, in fact. The Word
> contains His revealed will, it is His thinking, through it we are to
> be occupied with Him, there is no other way we can know Him, He
> revales Himself to us through His Word which is why it is referred to
> as His revelation to man.

Graeme, with due respect, the Doctrinal Statement above affirms the
infallibility of the _Bible_. That's quite a different matter from
asserting the infallibility of the Word of God. I'd affirm the latter
but I'd have questions about the former. To make declarative statements
about the Bible that the Bible doesn't make for itself is, well,
idolatry may be too strong, but, let me say... naughty :-)

Nigel: would you make that distinction?

Graeme wrote:
>
> "Rowland C. Croucher" <> wrote:
>
> >Graeme wrote:
> >>
>
> >> The first statement is absolutely correct and there is nothing
> >> idolatrous about it. Psalm 138:2 indicates the value that God puts on
> >> His Word -- "thou hast magnified thy word above they name [person]."
> >> The Word of God is the mind of Christ -- 1 Cor. 2:16. We are to feed
> >> on it, make it the priority of our life. Only by that means can we
> >> grow to spiritual maturity. The Word of God IS infallible. To say that
> >> calling it thus is giving is giving it an attribute that can only be
> >> ascribed to God is a contradiction -- absurd, in fact. The Word
> >> contains His revealed will, it is His thinking, through it we are to
> >> be occupied with Him, there is no other way we can know Him, He
> >> revales Himself to us through His Word which is why it is referred to
> >> as His revelation to man.
>
> >Graeme, with due respect, the Doctrinal Statement above affirms the
> >infallibility of the _Bible_. That's quite a different matter from
> >asserting the infallibility of the Word of God. I'd affirm the latter
> >but I'd have questions about the former. To make declarative statements
> >about the Bible that the Bible doesn't make for itself is, well,
> >idolatry may be too strong, but, let me say... naughty :-)
>
> >Nigel: would you make that distinction?
>
> I am unable to see the difference. The Bible [its contents, not the
> papaer it is written on] IS the Word of God. I fail to see how
> regarding it as such is even "naughty"!

Now, I didn't make myself clear. Of course the Bible is the Word of God.
But the Word of God (as that expression is used in the Bible) is _much
more_ than words on paper/parchment... IOW, let's use the term as the
Bible itself (pre-Gutenberg) uses it.

If that's not 'obvious' (now there's a word becoming popular on this
ng), I'll try to explain further.

Garry/Jill: sure this is the latest version of the SU statement of
faith? I thought since their Harare conference they changed it to be
more in line with what Jesus might have said (including Jesus' two key
kingdom values, justice/love)...

Garry and Jill Allen wrote:

> I found this statement of belief interesting. I would like to compare it
> with Scripture Union's (SUs) which is a fairly traditional evangelical
> stement of belief (and considerably shorter than the 39 Articles or the
> equivalent Lutheran or Calvinist statements) or even the Apostle's or
> Nicene Creed.
> > .
> Scripture Unions
> 1. the Unity of the Father, of the Son and of the holy Spirit in the
> Godhead.
> 2. The sovereignty of God in creation, providence, revelation,
> redemption and final judgment.
> 3. The divine inspiration and entire trustworthiness of the Holy
> Scripture's authority in all matters of faith and conduct.
> 4. The sinfulness and guilt of all men since the fall rendering them
> subject to God's wrath and condemnation.
> 5. Redemption from the guilt, penalty and power of sin solely through
> the sacrificial death of our representative and substitute, the
> incarnate Son of God.
> 6. The bodily resurrection of the lord Jesus Christ from the dead and
> his ascension to the right hand of God the Father.
> 7. The necessity of the work of the Holy Spirit to make the death of
> Christ effective to the individual sinner, granting him repentance
> toward God and faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.
> 8. The justification of the sinner, by the grace of God, through faith
> in Christ alone.
> 9. The indwelling and work of the Holy Spirit in the believer.
> 10. The one holy universal church which is the body of Christ and to
> which all true believers belong.
> 11. The expectation of the personal return of Christ.